What Happens Next | Special With Max Lucado

Hey, everybody. You're listening to A New Beginning, which is a podcast made possible by Harvest Partners. If this program has impacted you, I'd love to hear from you. So just send an email to me at gregatharvest.org. Again, it's gregatharvest.org.

You can learn more about becoming a Harvest Partner by going to harvest.org. Those lives seemed interrupted by disease. I've got a good friend whose daughter is 22 years old. She's already had 160 surgeries.

It's just tragic. I cannot wait for her to hear God say, I make all things new. I restore life to your body. I restore joy to your spirit. And he will make all things new. Amazing grace, how sweet the sound. Again you hear all the angels are singing.

This is the day, the day when life begins. Maybe you could go ahead and introduce him. I know he's a good friend of yours.

That's right, Dave. You're talking about my friend Max Lucado. And boy, does he have a way with words. And we're going to talk about his newest book that I think may be perhaps his most important book he's ever written. And the title of it is What Happens Next? But in case you don't know Max Lucado, and you've been living under a rock somewhere, Max has written 50 books.

And they've sold somewhere around 150 million copies around the world. And he has a way of taking that which is complex and making it understandable. Let me just read a quote from his new book titled What Happens Next? We're all headed somewhere. Each day brings us closer to a final breath, a final heartbeat, a final sigh.

No one is getting younger. Death comes to the young, the old, the rich, the poor, the decent, the decadent, the king and the commoner. Shouldn't our destination be an obsession? Great statement that's sort of summing up why you wrote this book, and it's a book on the return of Jesus Christ. Is this the first time you've addressed this topic in a book? I'm sure you've dealt with it before, but is this the first time you've written a whole book about this?

It's the first time. By the way, thank you, Greg. Thank you. I could spend the whole program telling everybody how much I admire you and love you and Kathy. Could we just change our plans, and would you do that? I'll do that. I'll do that. I could. I could.

No, thank you. Please continue. Yeah, so the book itself is not the very first book I've written about the return of Christ, but it is the first time I've tried to tackle the milestones that are going to happen, at least from my perspective, between now and the end of when Christ returns, and then describing our eternal state.

So it is by far the most detailed dive I've ever taken into the topic of end times. So I can say this to you, Max, because we're close to the same age. You know, we're not young men anymore. We're coming toward the end of our race, so we pray and hope, God willing. We have a few more gallons in the tank and maybe a couple more decades to keep going, maybe further, we don't know. But did you write this because you're getting older and you've become more reflective?

Is there something about the age you're at and where you're at in life that's caused you to say, I need to really think deeply, not just about the Lord's return, but about eternity in general? Absolutely, Greg. I'm genuinely curious about what's next. I really am.

I really want to know. I am very, very excited. I'm kind of like a kid outside the amusement park. I just can't wait to get through the gates. I'm super excited about what's going to happen. And I'm just fascinated with every topic. I want to talk about Armageddon. I want to talk about the Millennium.

I want to talk about the eternal state. I even want to ponder the Great White Throne Judgment, as horrible as that's going to be. But I want to have a clear understanding of what happens next.

And so I think that's part of it. I'm curious about what's next for me, but I'm very concerned about what's happening in the world. This is a unique generation in which we find ourselves. Watch what's happening around Israel and Gaza, which is terrible. The innocent people killed on both sides of the border. Watching what's happening with Russia and Ukraine, China and Taiwan. The plunge in morality here in our own nation. These are things that have caused me to lift up my eyes and say, Lord, is something major about to happen?

So I think this is an important conversation to be having personally in my life as I close in on 70 years, but also globally, as we're seeing so much chaos around the world. Well, we're talking with bestselling author Max LeCato today. We're excited to discuss his new book, What Happens Next?

We'll tell you how to get a copy a little later on. Max, you talk about what it'll be like when we come into God's presence. And sort of as a metaphor, you tell the story of your friend Joe Stowell, former president of Moody Bible Institute. Could you recall that story for us? That's a great story. Greg, do you know Joe?

Oh, yes. Joe's a great guy. Well, many years ago, Joe had the opportunity to do what you do often, Greg. He went to the White House.

This is in the term of President George W. Bush. And according to the way Joe told me, he was one of like a dozen pastors invited to visit with the president. And there was a reception, and he was rehearsing in his mind what he was going to say when he met President Bush. And finally, it was his turn, and they were not close to the president. There was about 20 feet.

They had to walk to get across the room. And so in his mind, he kept rehearsing, I'm Joe Stowell, I'm the president. Finally, he extended his hand. He said, Mr. President, I'm Joe Stowell, I'm the president of Moody Bible Institute. And before he could say another word, President Bush with that Texas twang slapped him on the shoulder and said, way to go, Joe, and then marched him off. And so he called his secretary. She said, what was it like meeting the president? And he told her that story. And by the time he returned to Chicago to Moody Bible Institute, she had made a T-shirt, had a T-shirt printed and placed on his chair in his office, said, way to go, Joe, George W. Bush.

That's great. So when he told me that story, I guess I was kind of touched with a word that was a little more from the Lord than from me, because I said, you know, Joe, you're going to someday stand before Jesus Christ, and he's not going to be in a hurry. And he's going to look you in the eyes and he's going to say, way to go, Joe.

Well done, good and faithful servant. You know, Greg, you're going to hear those words. Dave, you're going to hear those words. And I know that maybe a person could go their whole life and never hear those words, even from an earthly father. But when we hear those words from our Heavenly Father, it'll make it all worthwhile, all worthwhile. And that's what's waiting on us when we get home.

That's beautiful. You know, Max, the word revelation means the unveiling, and it's not God's desire to conceal, but to reveal. And Bible prophecy is not given to scare us, but to prepare us.

Yes. And I think whenever we raise the subject of end times, people immediately think of Armageddon, Antichrist, Mark of the Beast, et cetera. And that, of course, is all part of the story. But they don't think about what you've just said, because in the book of Revelation, we read about that final day when we'll stand before Christ. And what is the revelation an unveiling of? It's an unveiling of Jesus Christ. That's a spirit of prophecy. It's Christ, honored and glorified and magnified. And so what I love is that you have a gift to encourage people, not only in your writing and your preaching, but privately.

How many times I can think of getting a text from you, and it's a word of encouragement, as you just shared there with Joe and with the rest of us. And you're going to be encouraged reading this brand new book that Max has just written called What Happens Next? It's about end times events.

Yeah, he gets into all the topics you're interested in, but it's a book that focuses on Christ and will be an encouragement to you. And we want to send it to you for your gift of any size this month. Whatever you send will be used to help us continue to reach people through the teaching and preaching on this program you listen to called A New Beginning. So order your copy right now of Max Ocado's brand new book, What Happens Next? and be encouraged.

That's right. We'll have details in just a bit, but you can get information right now at Harvest.org. So Max, what prompted you to write a book on this subject? You know, as I've looked back, like you, Greg, I've been doing this quite a while, and I realized I could have taught on this more.

And so I'm at that time in my life where I'm realizing I don't know how many more years I'll have. I'm like you, Greg, I want to go to heaven from the pulpit. I don't want to stop preaching, but I want to make sure I've represented the Lord well. And when I read that about 30 percent of the Bible is prophecy, much of which has yet to be fulfilled, I realized that did not match my preaching.

I've not dedicated 30 percent of my teaching to end times. So I wanted to have one good opportunity to do that. And so I preached 16 weeks in a row at our church on the topic of end times.

And what we found, it was the most evangelistic series that we've ever had. People are ready. People want to know. You don't have to convince people, number one, that the world is a mess, and really don't have to convince people, number two, that they're a mess without Christ. Down deep they know this. And so what we're doing by giving them a view of end times is helping them have a way to face the future with faith.

You know, when you equip people with information about the future, you're giving them power to face the present. I remember some time ago I got stuck on a tarmac. You've probably had this happen. I spent four hours on a tarmac in Chicago in the dead of night in the middle of a storm. And it was terrible. It was terrible because the pilot said so little. I kept wanting him to come on the intercom and say, OK, here's where we are.

Here's what's going to happen. We were stuck there. I think many people feel stuck in life.

They're trapped, and they look outside, and they see lightning and storms, and they wonder if they're ever going to move. What we need is the pilot. And in our case, our pilot has spoken. Our Lord has spoken.

He has spoken abundantly about what to expect. Again, like you said, never to scare us, but always to prepare us and to tell us it is tough. In this world, you're going to have a lot of tribulation, a lot of turbulence, but you can be of good cheer. I've overcome the world, and the best of life is yet to be. My preacher growing up used to say your best day on earth wouldn't qualify as your worst day in heaven. I've never forgotten that. That's really true. What a wonderful life awaits us all.

That's right. You know, it's interesting what you were saying about 30 percent of the Bible is prophecy, and you felt you should have preached on it more. Why do pastors not speak on this topic more? People want to hear about it. Maybe let me ask you personally, why did you not speak on it more, and why are you speaking on it more now? And should other pastors listening tackle this subject?

Wow, what a great question, Greg. I think I was a bit intimidated by the topic. I know enough about you to know that you were blessed to come to Christ in the Calvary movement, and Pastor Chuck and the fathers of that movement really helped young people to come to an appreciation, correct, of end times. I loved where I was saved. I loved the tradition from which I came, but scarcely a word was said about end times. And I went all the way through seminary, never really studying the topic of the millennium, the topic of the rapture. I was well into my preaching years.

I remember when the Left Behind books came out in the 1990s, and some of my church members would come up to me and start asking me questions, and I realized I wasn't prepared. I didn't have good answers. And so I would have liked to—you know, I don't live with regrets. I really don't. I think, though, I could have done a little bit better early on at approaching this issue.

But I've really made up for it in the last 10 or 15 years. I've been devouring it. I'm consuming it.

I'm excited about it. So maybe this book, which is kind of an end times 101, maybe we could put it in the hands of young pastors and say, you don't have to agree with everything I've said, but here's a way to approach it. Because I do think, preachers, we need to be talking about this all the time. It's our message. The gospel and the return of Christ, this is our message. Tell us more about that future in the millennium and beyond that the believer will experience and what we might be doing. Well, thank you for that question, because there's no question more important. You know, the theme of the eternal state or heaven is God's words, I make all things new.

Yes. I make all things new. He is going to restore the beauty of the earth, to restore the beauty of the universe. He's going to restore the proper alignment in which we will serve beneath him, but reigning over creation.

And he will make all things new. You and I both know people who spent their whole life in wheelchairs, people whose lives seemed interrupted by disease. I've got a good friend whose daughter is 22 years old. She's already had 160 surgeries.

It's just tragic. I cannot wait for her to hear God say, I make all things new. I restore life to your body. I restore hope to your lungs. I restore joy to your spirit. I restore beauty to parts of our planet that have been ravaged by war and death. I can't wait for him to say, I restore all things. I make all things new to all the aborted babies, all the babies that never made their way into the arms of a mother. And God will restore that.

And like you say, Greg, I'm with you 100 percent. Jesus says, Well done, good and faithful servant. You've been faithful over a few things. I'll now make you ruler over many. I don't know what all that means, but that means we're going to rule over either areas or vicinities or precincts. We'll have responsibilities. We'll serve with joy. It'll be tireless. We'll be creative. We'll be exploring the beauty and the wisdom of God. Could be you're overseeing a galaxy, Greg.

It could be that I'm overseeing a South Africa. Who knows? But we'll all have responsibilities, and we'll be joined by all the saints who have gone before. You know, all the saints, Abraham and Moses and Martha and Ruth and Mary. And most of all, we'll be in the presence of Jesus Christ, our Savior. And we'll have the honor, the unspeakable honor of looking at him face to face. And all our questions will be gone, and we will enjoy perfect fellowship. No more sin. No more sin. That means no more lust, no more greed, no more pride, no more wars, no more fighting. All of that will be gone.

Beautiful. Okay, so let's do a lightning round. Let me hit you with terms that we hear, and why don't you just give us a quick definition of them, okay? I'll do my best. Here we go. We need some music, Dave.

Give us some lightning round music. All right. Okay, here we go, Max. What is a rapture? The rescue of the church prior to the great tribulation, which we will meet the Lord in the air and will be taken into paradise.

Excellent answer. Okay, you mentioned the tribulation. What is the great tribulation period? Seven years of difficulty and trial in which the restrainer, which is the presence of the Holy Spirit working through the church, is removed in which the Antichrist has his way.

But a great revival breaks out during the middle of the seven years in which many people return to Christ. And you mentioned Antichrist. Who is Antichrist?

The Antichrist is the proxy of Satan, a person who does the bidding of the devil, who creates and negotiates a peace treaty after the rapture because of the chaos of the rapture. And negotiates a peace treaty with Israel and the other nations, leading to what appears to be peace. But in the middle of that peace, he positions himself in the temple which he is allowed to be reconstructed and demands to be worshiped.

And then the result is anyone who doesn't worship him falls under persecution. So it'll be the most difficult. Jesus said there has never been a time and never will be another time as difficult as those seven years. What is the Battle of Armageddon?

The Battle of Armageddon is when, at the end of the seven years, Christ descends out of the heavens on a great white stallion, crowned with all the crowns, wearing many crowns. And he defeats those who would dare to defy his will and destroy his children. And the beauty of the return of Christ to the Valley of Armageddon is that we'll be with him.

We won't do the fighting. Jesus will do it all. But we will return with him. So what is the second coming? And maybe draw a contrast between the second coming and the rapture. The rapture is when Christ comes for his church. The second coming is when Christ returns with his church. And when he returns with his church, he will set up the kingdom that he long prophesied. And that prayer that we've all prayed, Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done, will be done on earth.

And what is that kingdom called? The Millennium. The Millennium is that golden era in which all the promises that God made to Adam and Eve, to Abraham, to David, and to Jeremiah will be answered. Christ will be crowned. Satan will be bound and thrown away into the bottomless pit for a thousand years. And righteous rulers will rule the earth.

The reason the world is upside down is because Christ is not regarded, Satan is alive and well, and evil rulers rule. All that's going to be changed. And for a thousand years, we will enjoy the Garden of Eden as God intended.

Beautiful. Christ will be crowned and Satan will be bound. What a beautiful summation of our future. Max, what's the one thing you'd say to those who know that they have a short time left?

What do they need to know about what's coming? Well, first of all, say yes to Jesus. The purpose of this life is to decide where we're going to spend the next life.

And so just say yes to him. Just make sure that your name, like I said earlier, is written in the book of life. And then embrace the brevity of this life. You know, it's going to fast quickly. I talk to people all the time as they're getting older, they're thinking, Oh, I've got to get this done before I die, or I want to do this before I die. And they're in such a sense of almost despair because they feel like their time is running out. Hey, if your hope is in heaven, you're going to have plenty of time to do everything that's wonderful.

So don't you worry about that. Go ahead and embrace the brevity of this life and then get excited about the beauty of the next life. One time when I turned 60 years of age, I took a big rope and I had my daughters over there all at the house. And I took a rope and I threw it over our balcony. And I said, let this rope represent my whole existence, my eternal life. And I gave each one of them a marker. And I said, now mark on this rope the duration of your father's life. And they looked at me, gave me a quizzical look. And then they began to nod.

And one of them said, Dad, I can't make the dots small enough. And that's really a picture of this life. I know it can be a challenge. I know it can be rough, but it's going to pass quickly. The apostle Paul talked about these brief and momentary struggles are not worth comparing with the glory that awaits us. So if your days are coming to an end, get excited, get excited. Not about how you use the rest of these days on earth, which is important, but how excited, how wonderful it's going to be the minute you close your eyes on this life and you begin your eternal life. And that all awaits anybody who just says yes to Jesus. Say yes to Jesus and your name is written in the only book that matters.

And that is the book of life. What does it mean to say yes to Jesus, Max? Someone's listening right now and they're saying, boy, that sounds great. You know, it reminds me of a cab ride I had some years ago. And we're driving along and we started talking about death. And the cab driver gave me his view of the afterlife, which is basically reincarnation. I waited until he was done. And he said, well, that's what I think about the afterlife.

What do you think? And then I told him what the Bible says, touching on many of the same points you just touched on. And he said, well, I like your version of the afterlife better than my version. And I said, well, and his name was Tom.

I said, Tom, it's not my version. This is what Jesus said. This is what the Bible says. So you say yes to Jesus. Someone like that cab driver, Tom, might say, I like your version of the afterlife.

I want that for myself. How do I say yes to Jesus? You just confess that you're a sinner.

That is to say that your life is not on target. That you've fallen short of what God's original intent was. And you say, yes, I'm a sinner. But, Lord, you're my Savior.

And you came for me. And you offer for me the gift of heaven, eternal life. And so I confess I'm a sinner. Would you please forgive me for my sins? I give you my life. I trust you with my soul.

In Jesus' name, amen. It's really that simple. That's right.

Really that simple. So you're listening to Max Lucado. He's written a brand new book called What Happens Next? It's about this life. It's about the afterlife. It's about the signs of the times. It's about the return of Jesus Christ and a whole lot more.

I think this may be one of the most important books Max has ever written. And I want you to get a copy of it. And we're going to send it to you for your gift of any size. So whatever you send will be used to extend our ministry. Now, some of you can be generous and send more.

Others, maybe not as much. But whatever you send will rush you your copy of Max Lucado's brand new book, What Happens Next? Yeah, that's right. We've got a copy waiting for you. The book is brand new.

It's just out this month. So thank you for your partnership in helping this ministry reach more people with the gospel. And to thank you tangibly, we'll be glad to send you What Happens Next?

by Max Lucado. Just call us at 1-800-821-3300. That's 1-800-821-3300. Or write A New Beginning, Box 4000, Riverside, CA 92514.

Or go online to harvest.org. And just a moment ago, Max suggested how we can pray and ask Jesus to be our Savior. If you took that step and prayed along with Max, we want to help you get started as a brand new follower of Christ. Let us send you Pastor Greg's New Believer's Bible.

It's the perfect resource for someone who's new to the faith, with scores of study helps that will answer your questions and build a strong foundation for growth. We'll send it free of charge. Just ask for the New Believer's Bible when you call 1-800-821-3300. That's a 24-7 phone number, 1-800-821-3300.

Or write A New Beginning, Box 4000, Riverside, CA 92514. Or go online to harvest.org. Hey everyone, I want you to know about our app called Harvest Plus. Think of it as a Harvest version of Netflix.

We have all of our resources in one place. We have our movies like Steve McQueen, The Salvation of an American Icon, Johnny Cash, The Redemption of an American Icon, A Rush of Hope, and much more. Then we have our television program, daily devotions, and much more.

So go and download the Harvest Plus app. Next time, insight based on the life of Elijah. It's from Pastor Greg's series called Elijah, The Power to Stand. Join us here on A New Beginning with pastor and Bible teacher, Greg Laurie. This is the day, the day when life begins. Thanks for listening to A New Beginning with Greg Laurie, a podcast made possible by Harvest Partners. Helping people everywhere know God. Sign up for daily devotions and learn how to become a Harvest Partner at harvest.org.